S2 E5: OTTB Underdog Stories: From Kissing Spine Diagnosis to RRP Freestyle Triumph

S2 E5 (Transcript): OTTB Underdog Stories: From Kissing Spine Diagnosis to RRP Freestyle Triumph
[00:00:00] A fun fact about me is that all of my best friends my whole life have been Polish, and I don't know what it is about Irish and Polish people coming together, but they're good. They're drinking buddies. That's why. Yes. Yes. . Hi everyone. And welcome back to OTTB on tap. I'm Niamh. And I'm Emily. Hey Niamh, what's on tap today? Today we're sharing an incredible story in our OTTB Underdog Stories series.
Our guest is Juliana Prussack and an amateur rider from Central Texas whose journey with HER OTTB. NEMO is one of perseverance and inspiration. Juliana recently entered our O TTB market slash O TTB ONTAP Underdog Contest. Just narrowly came in runner up, though she got hundreds of votes. We're so excited to have her here and share her story.
Juliana and Nemo faced a kissing spine diagnosis, surgery, and rehab this year, and despite all of that, they competed at the Retired Racehorse Project makeover in October. Juliana, welcome to the podcast. Hey, so glad to be here, and thank you guys so much for inviting me. Thank you guys so much for inviting me and to be able to showcase Nemo's story and be able to tell you guys about his journey.
Juliana, thank you so much for being here. So we're going to continue to call you Jules as we just spoke off mic a little bit about the uniqueness of your names and how you've got your nickname Jules, which I love because it's one of my very good friends names as well. Your passion for thoroughbreds goes way back into your childhood near Arlington racetrack in Chicago.
But what really caught my attention is how you started riding. sneaking into the pasture to hop on your grandmother's plow horse in Poland. Can you tell us a little bit more about those early experiences and how they shaped your love for horses? Yeah. So my grandma, she's got a small farm down in Southern Poland.
It's in a town named Roznów. There's not many people around there. And she had a horse named Kashtan that she actually bought way before I was born. She actually bought him a few hours away. She actually took a bus out there to the auction. Picked him up and hand walked him back to the ranch.
Or farm, sorry. Yeah, no, she, I swear, I get all her, the courageous stuff from her and, She's amazing. But basically half my childhood was spent over at that farm and every time like no one was looking, I would go out to the pasture and go jump on him and stuff and then get yelled at by my mom or I would wake up really early in the morning, help like milk the cows.
And then I would be running back to the barn and go grabbing the horse and doing everything possible with him. Was awesome. His name was Kaszczan, which means chestnut in Polish. Yeah very unique. I know he was a chestnut horse with a blaze and a little bit of like head socks.
Definitely wasn't taught to ride, only knew how to plow, but that didn't stop little Jules to jump, jumping on him. So I love it. And did he take okay to that without being really a riding horse? Was he pretty tolerant? He was fine with me. Yeah. I was going to say, I think he was pretty tolerant. He lived up to like his mid twenties, but I Niamhr put a saddle on him.
I just rode him around bareback and then when, yeah, he was awesome. Minus when me and my cousin rode on him Both of us on his back and a motorcycle spooked him a little bit. And my cousin fell off and I grabbed onto the main and I was like, that was the best time of my life. And my mom was like, oh, I need to get you riding lessons.
This is scary. Let's see how that works. Yeah. That's where the drugs started, going to say your story about riding this big chestnut horse with a blaze. Is giving me throwbacks to National Velvet for some reason. Oh, yeah. That's all I can think of. Oh, yeah. I really wanted to yeah I've Niamhr really watched that movie or book or whatever, but everybody talks about how great it is.
I've only seen Black Beauty, I think I was just actually thinking about something we should do for a Christmas episode, and I really want to do a recap of a horse movie that features a thoroughbred, and I think that might have to be the movie that we do.
I don't know. I think it has to be Sylvester. Come on now. Oh, Sylvester is good. Oh, there's so many choices, actually, where I think we're going to query the group. Yeah. Yeah. This week. I'm going to have to do a Google deep dive on all these because I don't like, I don't know what you guys are talking about.
So anyway later when you were at Iowa state, you worked at the test barn at Prairie Meadows. That sounds like such a unique experience. Can you explain what the test barn is and what it was like working so close to racehorses? It was fun. So some of my friends actually started working there the year prior to that and a lot of their workers for the next following summer they were graduating and leaving Iowa, which was a bummer, but I hopped on it because I wanted to see the other side of the track because I used to actually do a little bit of exercise riding.
Oh yeah, that's how I got got into thoroughbreds first. And then when I went to college, I stopped that. And I wanted to see that side. And it was really interesting to see how the blood draws and getting the urine samples and bringing it back to Iowa State to do all the diagnostic stuff to do the drug testing.
And I actually now Work at TVMDL, which is the Texas Veterinary Diagnostic Lab. And we were this past fiscal year we stopped, but we used to do the drug testing for the Texas Racing Commissions. Yeah, so I got to do that portion this past two years. So that was fun. So I basically did a full circle from starting at the track from hand walking to exercise, riding to grabbing the samples to then running.
Does this mean that you're really good at whistling? Yes. Yep. Huh. Yeah. I had to whistle a lot. Oh God. A lot of chapstick was there. For the listeners that don't know what we're talking about it's a trade secret that racehorses are taught to pee on demand. By the Pavlovian technique of whistling.
So I don't know. I feel like it works on a lot of them, but [00:06:00] I just remember quivering in the back of those kickboards sometimes and like whistling out in the back, please pee stop stop panicking. I know it's scary in here. You can't see your friends, but please just do it. That's amazing.
Okay. So let's talk about your, our peahorse Nemo. Can you remind us what his jockey club name is? Yeah. His name's too much crown. Oh, I actually love that name. And I don't know why, like I've maybe it made me think of crown Royal. Is it crown? Oh, that's exactly where my thought process was. I went to deep dive and tried to figure out what was his barn name before?
And someone actually told me, Oh, it was whiskey. I'm like, he's not a whiskey. We're like no. I love it. I, this totally offshoot of this, but the only relationship I have to crown Royal is that my boyfriend told me when he was a kid, he used to keep his marbles and a crown Royal bag.
That's just funny. Love that. I think is the only liquor that I cannot drink because I had Niamhr had it. Really? The honey one's actually pretty good. That one I could probably do. I may or may not have had an experience in my younger days of too much crown Royal, really cute guy. You just look at that purple velvet bag and you're like, I can't, I was a working student at the time.
The next morning I had to go. I was like trying to muck the stalls and my. My trainer came in and he was like, what did you get into last night? And he felt so bad for me that he actually sent me back to bed and mucked all the stalls. But then he made me ride the bounciest horse we had that afternoon. That was like So anyway, that's, yeah, we digress. Okay. So tell us how he came into your life and what was it about him that made you say he's the one? So actually I started looking for thoroughbred it was 20, yeah, 2023, like in February. February, I started casually looking because I lost my heart horse a year prior to that, to a pasture accident. And I thought it was time to try to find find another thoroughbred, try to help it after its racing career.
So ideally I was trying to find a sale project. Lo and behold, that, that's not what happened, of course. But I did actually have to have ankle surgery in August and because I broke it. Earlier on in the year. Yeah, I toughed it out six months. I was like, oh, this isn't broken hiked on it. Yeah Oh, yeah Wake boarding I went cliff jumping everything and I was just like that's fine It's no big deal.
And then I tried jumping my friend's horse before I went to Poland when I where my fiance actually proposed to me and I was like, Oh, no, I can't jump. Like this hurts. Yeah. I was like, this is really wrong. So I finally had my surgery in August and I was just laying there and I saw his photo posted by I don't know if you guys know her Jade favor.
Yeah. Louisiana. Yeah. So she posted him and he just had , this is going to sound so weird. His eye looked, he looked stoned out of his mind. Like he just looked like a straight up stoner and he just seemed very relaxed in this, like very calm. And I was like, Oh, he seems pretty cool, but that's not my type of horse whatsoever.
Like I like the hot, I like the spicy. The chestnut mare in a gelding formation. That's my favorite. And so I reached out to her and she wrote down that he was like a slight roar, which that to me, I don't care about that. I like those little underdog stories, the ones that people just don't want to give a second chance to, cause they're just like, Oh no, there's something wrong with it.
It's not going to work out. But I was. Two days post off. So I was like, there's no way I can drive out eight hours and with a truck and trailer to go pick this horse up. So I was like, yeah, it's meant to be maybe he'll pop up eventually later down the road or I'll find something that's more perfect for me.
A month later, Christina Hobbs from reciprocity thoroughbreds when she used to be in Aledo, Texas. Now I think she's in up in the Fort Worth area. She posted him and I was like, there's no way that this is the same horse cause she was calling him Nemo. But he just had that same build.
I asked her a couple of questions. I was like, Hey, is this the horse that Jade had? Is this too much crown? Is this a slight roar? She's yeah, actually I'm like, I'll be there Saturday. Just let me be there. I was just like, So I show up with my friend that trains Mustangs in my boot. Cause I can't ride.
And I get out of the trailer or a truck and she's Oh, you're not going to try him. I'm like, no, I just want you to hand walk him straight line. I need you just to jog him once or twice. She's this is going to be the easiest sale. And she's you're not going to do it with people.
And I'm like, My friend starts laughing. She's no, like we do Mustangs. This is like the best we can do. Usually we see them in the pen and we're just trying to eyeball them and figure out if they're okay. Christina has a really great eye for horses too, so I feel like that's a good, trusted, and so does Jade, obviously she sells her money, them to sport horse homes that between those two connections, you can feel like, okay, they both like the horse.
It's probably somewhat good. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I was talking a lot with Jade and that was my first time speaking with Christina and it was really nice that she was very open and honest because he actually stepped on something that weren't like literally an hour before we were supposed to show up and she's texting me right off the bat.
She's Hey, he stepped on this. He's not lame. I just want to let you know I understand if you don't want to come and see him anymore. And I'm like, yeah, It's okay. It's fine. Cause it was just like a small little speck of metal, but she wanted me to like, at least know about it.
So yeah, I was like, it's fine. They always have great timing. Don't they? Oh, they know. Oh, totally. Especially this one. I swear. This horse. Yeah. He likes to keep me on my toes. So you brought him home. I take it. Oh yeah, definitely. I was bawling like a baby and everything when I handed her the, the money and everything like that.
And then he stayed with my friend at her place where she trains Mustangs for about a week, just cause we wanted to see how he would be like, Oh, I forgot this part. I when we showed up there we walked into the bar and he was actually Just hanging out on cross ties and there was a horse freaking out right next to him rearing bucking just being spunky little four year olds are [00:12:00] and he's just sitting there and I'm like, there's no way this horse is this chill my first thought process I was he's either that chill or he's Drugs.
Yeah, that's exactly. I was like, there's no way. No, he's that chill. I can throw like literally umbrellas in his face and that horse could care less. That's amazing. Bubbles are the thing that get, get to, Oh yeah, no, I can range for them. Yeah. I can put him through the weird, trail obstacles.
No problem. Drag something doesn't bat an eye. You guys saw his RP costume stick something on his head, could care less. Bubbles from a bubble machine. Oh no. That's like a death trap. . . That's so funny. I feel like there's always like something, the one thing that's gonna hit them. Yeah. The one thing, yeah.
Emily had a horse that was afraid of Velcro, which, oh yeah. Wait, oh that she was also afraid of she had also been to the track and was afraid of hoses so and didn't know how to be hosed off and I was like how is that very dangerous it can bite yeah it can exactly you Niamhr know what they're gonna do yeah sometimes they have that little weird little weird thing about them.
I love that serendipitous kind of connection between you guys. That's pretty cool. Yeah, no, I'm happy that he brought those two lovely ladies into my life because I definitely still keep track with them and everything. Oh, it's awesome. I'm sure they're so excited to see how you guys did this year.
Oh, they were losing their absolute mind. I didn't believe this was actually going to happen, but I'm going to go with it. So speaking of part of your underdog story is that Nemo was unfortunately diagnosed with kissing spine earlier this year, and that can be a pretty tough diagnosis.
Can you take us through the beginnings of how you started thinking maybe something was wrong and. How the diagnosis was confirmed? Yeah as for rp you can start riding your horses december 1st and the first month he was actually perfect. He was perfect. January.
I got him fitted for a saddle with our saddle fitter everything was Amazing and then like I started noticing actually in early february he would lift his tail just ever so slightly. Everybody thought I was crazy for this. I was like, no, he's lifting his tail and he's moving it to the right.
That doesn't seem like it's normal. They're like, no, you're just being overcautious. Cause my old horse actually had kissing spine in 11 spots. So his was super, yeah, his was, yeah, but he was still jumping like crazy. When he passed away at 19, I was still going over three, three, three, six jumps, with him.
Some of them don't have any clinical issues. We only found it as a fluke because he actually was, got into some nightshade in his pastures. Yeah. And so he, yeah, so he was acting a little crazy with that, but that's besides the point, but that's how we found his kissings.
Kissing spine that didn't affect him. But yeah, so in February it was that slight tail lift. And then towards the end of February, I remembered having one specific ride where I had one of my friends that does dressage, come out and watch me and I noticed that he was super tense under saddle.
And then a couple of days later, he actually kicked out once. And I was like, like there's something wrong. So I asked my friend Camille with the Mustangs, if I could bring them over for a couple of days, can you validate what you're seeing or what I'm seeing?
You're seeing it as well. I think she only did about two rides on him and she's no, there's something wrong. Our chiropractor looked at him. She's like, I think it's kissing spine. You should probably have your vet take a look at it. So actually on March 18th that was my heart horse's birthday.
We went to the vet and my that palpated his back and he actually double barrel kicked out. Yeah. And he's yeah, no, that's. That's a positive. That's a strong response. Yeah. I was like, yeah, I figured it's there. And so he had about five touching when they did the x ray right there that we could see.
But then they did another x ray for pre op and they found five touching and one overlap. Oh, wow. An overlap. Just, and we don't have to have this in the recording, but would you be willing to share your, one of your x rays with us? Oh, definitely. Yeah. I can share you guys those x rays.
I can share you guys my old horse's x rays. I'm totally cool with all that stuff. That would be very cool. Cause I, we haven't really gotten into kissing spine in a, more pinpointed way, like we are with you. And this is going to be the first time we're talking about it.
And we want to make sure that like the information that we share, like correlates to something that has some backing because there's just a lot of misinformation, a lot of there's a lot of gray area, right? And so it's really important to like, here, this is one story. Your mileage may vary, but I think it's also good for people to understand what they're looking at when they look at the x rays and know the difference.
And what's really tough too. You can see me nodding. What's really tough to do is that, you have horses that have very mild close points and might have very big clinical signs. And then you have horses that have, all of their points are touching, like you said, with your heart Horace and might not have any clinical signs.
We were at like the 5 percent mark of knowing what, Kissing Spine is really all about, and I think it's just really important to continue this conversation and educate everybody because vets are learning about this in real time. Yes, this has existed for a long time, but it's only now in the forefront of PPEs and veterinary medicine and things that people are actually focusing on.
And yeah, I think anything that you can give to support your story would be awesome for us. Yeah, no, exactly. And , I heard this study like it's 80 percent of horses will have kissing spine, but it doesn't mean that they're actually going to be positive to the pain response and Yep.
Yep. So absolutely. My vet Dr. Nathan Canada, he works at Texas equine. He actually works under the guy that actually invented the ostectomy surgery. Oh gosh. Oh wow. Yeah. Dr. Cliff Honus. And so that's the only reason why I even went about with the surgery is because I trust [00:18:00] both of their judgments and I know that Dr.
Canada wouldn't have recommended that surgery if he didn't believe it would have been in Nemo's best interest because I went straight off the bat. I was like can't we do this? inject can't we just do the ligament snip? Can I just do all the exercises, even though I was already riding I was making him put his head down.
I was doing the stretches. I was making him , do the ab workout thing. He's the tucks and stuff. I was doing all that prior to even knowing he had kissing spine just because of bellow my other horses past. I was like, I'm going to try to avoid that. Like a 10 foot pole type of situation.
I don't want to go anywhere near that. Yeah. So he's the one, the spaces that were super close, like I can't, he was like, I can't even get a needle through it. And he's and also he's the biggest concern was the overlap. And you can see it, even just looking at his back, I wish I, I have to find a photo so I can send it to you guys.
He had a small lump and you can see, and we're thinking that maybe that was where the overlap was. Yeah. Wow. So then on March 23rd, he had his surgery. Cause I didn't want to wait. I don't make that much money. I, poor horse girl status over here. I was already thinking, I was like, Oh, I can put this on a credit card. I can do this. I can do that. I can pick up a second job. My friend Camille white with Camille's Mustangs, she's an amazing friend. She actually fundraised neurosurgery surgery bill.
Yeah. She did a lay down series to teach your horse how to lay down and all the proceeds went to paying for his surgery. And she actually covered 3, 000 out of the four and a half thousand dollars. A big shout out to Camille. She sounds like an amazing friend. Yeah. If you guys need anybody to train your horse, she's your girl.
Too bad. She's not closer to Pennsylvania. All right. I was gonna ask a little more about the surgery that you chose and if I'd Niamhr heard of that OCO to me, how do you say, I think I'm saying it I'm probably someone's probably going to be listening to this and saying, I'm.
I'm saying it wrong. It's like a stack to me. So it's basically when you you shave off the bone. So there's different, yeah. So there's different type of, bone shave surgeries that some people will do. I don't really agree with some of them. The ones that Dr. Harness and Dr.
Canada do is where they'll shave the in between spaces. And if they've made a big enough space as if they can insert like their index finger in between. So that's how you, yeah. And then there's other people that actually lob off the top part of the vertebrae of every other vertebrae. And I don't.
That's the surgery I was very concerned about. I didn't want that because I just felt like it was just gonna compromise the just the integrity of the spine in general. So when Dr. Canada explained to me, he's no, we don't do it this way. We do it this way.
This is how Dr. Hannes has been doing it. He's had lot of success with it for years. A lot of his hunter jumpers, even western horses that have had it years ago. Cause I think the first time he did it was either in 2015 or 2013. Don't quote me on that one, but they're still working and showing and all that stuff.
If those horses are still riding pretty well, then I was like I think my five year old has a chance at least at least I can say I gave him a chance. It's interesting that you bring this up because I think the Chronicle of the Horse released an article today, or not today, but this week, about a horse that had a very, it's a different name for it when it involves the neck, but it was a horse that BCVM.
Yeah, and it was like had the same type of surgery where they actually remodel like the shape of the bones and the neck to create more space versus clipping anything or injecting anything. And the horse went on to have a really good career and everything like that. But so it sounds like this might be a little bit of the modern wave of all of the things that they've tried, but.
Again, I think your mileage will vary depending on. I was going to say if I had the money to be able to do the testing for to see if Nemo had ECVM first prior to doing the surgery, I would totally go down that route, but just the extra diagnostics and stuff and just being, I guess Oh God, I'm close to my thirties.
I'm going to say I'm 20 still in my twenties. Still, I couldn't afford that. Mid forties. Women over here. Whatcha talking about? You guys don't look good. Day over 25. I We love you . Yeah. I turned 46 on Saturday, so No way. No, you're lying. . Emily and I were both bright red. Okay. Yeah. I'm just bright red. You're how we need to keep her on. On the podcast. Now she gives out compliments. You're welcome back anytime tools. So you get the surgery done late March, right? And what can you tell us about the rehab and the rehabilitation journey after your surgery?
About like 10 days post op. Cause My vet actually staples it shut and then he stitches a towel on top. So I have a, like a little bit of vet tech knowledge in in my background, just because I did a lot of research, back at Iowa state with this, swine and small animals and also horses.
So he was like, you can get the towel out. Here's your scissors. You got it. No biggie. So I took the, I was like, Cool. Thanks. Gee, I can do that on someone else's horse. Not mine. But okay, thanks. Isn't that so funny how you can do that on someone else's horse but not your own? The grosser the better on anybody else but my own horse.
Oh yeah, no problem. Yeah when I started at TVMDL, I used to do necropsies. So that to me this is no problem. This is easy. Me going up there, standing on a mounting block, and I'm like staring. My mom was visiting from Chicago, and she's looking at me. She's are you going to be okay?
And I'm like, I don't know if he's going to kick me if I'm trying to get this towel out or not. But I'm not doing okay up here. But yeah, no, took the towel out 10 days post op, and then two weeks post op, we took the staples out. Then I had to bring him back to the vet a week later.
So we can do steroid [00:24:00] injections in between the vertebrae where they did the bone shaves. . Where they made the space. Yeah. Where they made those spaces. And then a week after that, so it's four weeks post-op. I was Dr. Canada the week prior to gave me os to inject him.
So I gave him 15 mils of OS to help with the bone remodeling so it wouldn't come back. Cause no matter what, the bone's going to remodel and it sometimes might look ugly. I was warned about that, that he even told me, if we X ray in a year, it might look ugly, but don't worry.
He's it's fine. It's not going to bother him. The nerve endings up there are already dead. Yeah. They might grow back, but he's he can't feel it. I promise you it might look ugly, but the osmosis is going to help them. , all right, I trust your judgment. We're already here. So it's not like I can take back the, the surgery or anything.
And so during that time, from surgery to the three weeks post op, he had to be in a stall or in a small pen. And then at eight weeks he was able to go out into a bigger pack. So what was it back in May? So it was mid May when I went to get our spring vaccines. And I was like, Hey, can you just see if he's okay?
Are we good to go to do more demanding stuff? Like for our rehab? Cause I was walking him about, Oh God I can't even remember those days because I was literally waking up at 4 a. m. before work to go to the barn because my barn's about 40 ish minutes away from where I live. Yeah. Yeah, it's rough.
Same for me. Yeah I would walk him for 30 minutes before work. My fiancé would go in the middle of the day because he's a student here at Texas A& M so he has more free time. that lucky duck. And then after work, I would go there and I would stay there till nine o'clock walking him for 30 minutes.
So he walked about five or six times a day and there's a slight incline at the barn. And from the get go, I started walking him up and down that incline. I think we did each walk Two miles, if not more for that 30 minute walks. And we just increased from there. Cause I didn't want him to lose any of that muscle tone on his back.
Cause if they don't use it, then they lose it. Yeah. But mid may is when when he got those spring vacs, my vet said no, he's good to go to start doing like more intensive work. You can start using the Equiband or you can do Aqua He recommended a veterinarian that's actually an hour away from us that does rehab, and he has an aqua tread, he's got all the fun stuff, and all that, those things, so I reached out to him and asked him if he had availability for taking on Rehab for at least just about three to four weeks.
So he can at least get the muscle tone back and be able to be watched by a professional to get those back. Cause I trust myself, but I didn't want to do it wrong. And I just do it, do the best way possible with Nemo, just because he's put his heart and soul into basically like everybody he's graced I don't know like he was there. He's been good. He's someone needed a lookout for him Yeah, so he went to dr. Payne at Payne equine and he did about four weeks of aqua tread So they started off with three Three days for the first week and then went to four days for the second week And I think they increased it up to by the time he left every single day he was on the AquaTread.
That's amazing. So that, that helped him significantly up until he came back and three days later in turnout, he decided to stab his stifle. So I you were going through this whole story. I was going through in my mind and I was like, okay, so now we're at may. So we're months out from the makeover.
And then you haven't even spoken about that. And then I was like, wait, when was she actually allowed to start being weight bearing on her leg? And what was going on there? Oh, technically I wasn't supposed to start riding until January on my leg. I started I guess some of my friends were letting me borrow their horses.
Camille obviously was letting me borrow or not borrow. I basically stole a lot of her horses when she didn't have time to ride on. And I started, I think in October when I should not have. So I hope my doctor is not listening to this cause I'm going to get in a lot of trouble. But no, I didn't start riding him until.
Mid August, so I only had a month and a half of training on that horse. Yeah, so we were, biting the bullet. I was terrified. I was like, nope, we're not going to make it. This is not going to happen. And Camille, she's the one, she's suck it up, Girl Scout. You're going. Too bad. So sad.
You got this horse. He said, if you do the R. P., you got to do a Mustang makeover. So you got to go. And I'm like, okay. So you had. accepted and then had declared your discipline already at this point? I declared officially we were able to, I think it was August 15th and I waited till literally the last second that literally 459 because I'm like sitting there debating.
I knew I was going to do freestyle, but from the get go, I wanted to do a venting. I was like that's off the table. Yeah. As soon as the surgery, that's off the table. I was like maybe I can do still hunters or jumpers.
And then I'm sitting there and I was like, if we're good, after the AquaTread, I was like, yeah, we're fine. We're, this is great. We have enough time to get, build up some jumping muscle. Yeah. Then those stupid little.
Fish nugget decides a millimeters away. Stab is stifle. I'll send you one of those photos too, because I was literally eye twitching. And so it was my vet. He's all he's really testing, your abilities here. I'm like, you're testing my patients for the slash bank account.
Oh yeah. Jules does not have a bank account anymore. It's Nemo's bank account. And stifle injuries are one of those things too, where. Unfortunately, there are very few stifle puncture type injuries that are not extremely problematic. I don't know of anyone that's had one that they were like, no, it was fine after a day or two.
It's it's always just like a month. Yeah. It was [00:30:00] awful. I was eye twitching. When it happened, we're like, do we stitch it or do we not stitch it? And Oh my God, it's such a hard place to do any of that. Exactly. I was like, just leave it. I don't care if it's ugly.
Let's just leave it. Did he actually puncture the joint itself? No, I'm not kidding you. It was millimeters. If It went like maybe a smidge more, it would have been donezo. Yeah. It would have gotten in the joint. That's what we were questioning, if we stitched it closed, if he has an infection, it's going to get into the joint if we keep it open.
Yeah, exactly. But then it's ugly. I don't care if it's ugly. For all I care. , it can look like Scarface on that leg. I just don't want it to get hurt. Yeah. Yeah, no, August I, actually, then I messaged Shannon Reed, who is the vet for RRP, and I was like, hey, I have this big dilemma, I really want to jump, but this is what's on the table for me I really need a judgment or just just help me out here.
So she played out everything, like what the rules are for each discipline and what I should expect. Are you going to be asking too much of him? Yeah. And , I was like, he's done too much already for me. He's already this was a dream of mine to go to this horse show.
Oh gosh. Since 2015, when I like found out about it. So , We're going to do freestyle cause I've always wanted to do that. And we're just going to do dressage as a warmup and see if I still remember how to do that stuff. Sounds really fair.
All things considered. Oh my goodness.
So can you explain a little bit about the freestyle competition? For listeners that may not know like how's it judged? What kind of skills does it test? What is the training like? Yeah, so what the judges are specifically looking for.
They're looking for the degree of difficulty. So if they want to see if you can ride bridalists or tackless or any of those things are going through obstacles, they want to see that the horse is doing this willingly, like super relaxed. If the horse is stressed out or not, you're obviously going to get point stop.
And also they want to see the harmony between the horse and rider. This is also a place where you can show the opportunity to show your special skills. Tricks that if you've taught your horse. To lay down, sit on a beanbag chair these props. And just if you can catch I guess the spectator's attention and all that, yeah, so that's what they're looking for in freestyle. And how did you go about picking what you were going to do for your freestyle, and how did Nemo perform in it? So Christina, when she picked up Nemo she picked up another horse and she also named that one. And so she obviously had a Finding Nemo theme when she picked those two up and Finding Nemo is my favorite movie.
So I, yeah, so I was like, I can't change his name. It's perfect. Yeah. I wanted to go with, you buried the lead there, I think, honestly, I feel like this horse was meant for me. But So I was like, Oh, we got to do finding Nemo. I already have something envisioned in my head and my friend, I keep talking about her, but that's because she's so amazing.
She's the freestyle guru. I'm not kidding you. This girl has won so many freestyles for the Mustang makeovers. So she helped me figure out how we can put. My idea together and make it look, not super choppy and bad because I'm not creative whatsoever. Yeah, we had a lot more ideas, but we had to pull a lot of them away just because we didn't have the time to train them.
And also because a lot of some of our friends couldn't make it from Florida that also do Mustangs. And I was worried about the props coming in with people that don't know how to set up props for freestyles. I was like, no, we're just leaving them behind. Let's just try to make this as easy and as fun as possible for everybody.
Yeah. And were there any moments in the competition that really stood out for you either as highlights or learning experiences with him? Oh, I was panicking because as soon as we got to Kentucky he was lame. So I'm not kidding you. So you know how everybody on Monday and Tuesday are able to walk around and ride their horses.
I was not, no, Tuesday I literally hand walked him in the dressage arena, walked him in the covered arena. I was like, all right what was it? Wednesday we had our prop school and , I think Wednesday was our dressage midday or so. I was like, we're gonna see if he's soundin if I have to scratch for dressage.
I called the chiropractor that was there. There was this really amazing girl that was competing that brought her MagnaWave. And I'm like, you come here now. I need you. Oh, I was stressed. Everyone's are you okay? I'm like, I'm fine. No, I haven't really warmed up my horse. I don't know how he's gonna be.
I drove a thousand miles and he's lame. So do you think it was just from the stress of traveling? Oh, I he eats like a cow on the trailer. I'm not kidding you. I thought like I overpacked, I brought 10 bales of hay for one horse. . . Yeah. That's what I've done any, anytime I've I'm a panic person.
Yeah. And then instead of eating from his hay net, he was bending over and getting it from the hay bales that were stacked next. Perfect. Great. And the next stall over. And I'm like, you special. No, he was fine. I think he overexerted himself in Tennessee where we stopped, did a layover because he was galloping like the heavens. And I think he tweaked his muscle and he popped a rib and he's one of those Oh, the pH, of the soil is too high. And he is chestnut. They are special, aren't they? Yeah. They're a little special. That's why I'm like, little sensitive.
We love you. So taught me grace. That's for sure. Did you end up competing in the dressage when you were there? Did that work out? I did. Yeah, we actually, so that morning I pulled him up and I pulled out the lunch and I was like let's see if all this magic worked. Sure enough. , he was a little still stiff, but
it's good enough that I think we can work out of it. And another competitor next to us, her friend brought a red light therapy and she was like, here, take this all day, use it until your dressage class. Bet let's do it. We're doing that. Sat with him. I'm not kidding you for 30 minutes.
Three plus hours with that red light on his shoulder and everything. No, we, we got [00:36:00] 45th, out of all, the competitors in dressage. There's a lot of people in dressage. Yeah. That's it. It was like a hundred and something. So I was pretty proud of that, especially since we only had a month and a half of training.
So I was happy. And then. When we had our prop school so this is my first time doing a makeover. I didn't know how it was going to go. I thought they would play our music in the background. No, nothing. And they're just like, all right, you got two more minutes left in the arena.
And I didn't even go to any of my stuff. I'm in danger. That's exactly what I sounded like. So I was just like, all right, let's just grab this flag. I'm just going to canter around this like arena and see if he freaks out. And we're going to go from there. No, he didn't freak out.
So I was like, all right, we're just going to wing it. I didn't even practice my full freestyle, movements until the preliminaries. We just went with it. Cause we just had it mapped out on a piece of paper. That's fine. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I'm one of those procrastinators. Can you tell?
I don't know anything about that. Yeah. You had a little kid problems. You didn't have much of a choice, I think. And you're procrastinating on this. I don't know that I would necessarily call it that. But yeah, I'm curious, since the RP is such a big stage for OTT bees and trainers, What was the atmosphere like?
Did it affect him at all? I know you said he's pretty laid back. And then also how did it feel? How did it make you feel to see him out there and all the challenges that you've been through and then you finally got there? What was that like? The people there It's me. I want to go again.
The people are so sweet. So amazing. They, I've Niamhr met so many people that will literally bend over backwards or give the shirt off their backs to help you guys out. It's truly is the happiest horse show you'll ever go to. And if anybody's debating it, listening to this podcast don't debate it.
Just go you will love it hands down. After competing in the prelims, I didn't care about the points. I just wanted to just do the freestyle and just show off my horse and just. basically just show people that yes, you can do it. Yes, he had kissing spine, but look at him now , look where we're at.
And I was smiling from ear to ear as soon as we got off that small bridge that we walked off on and we dragged our shark. I was like he's amazing. He didn't ask for any of this. I'm asking him to do all these. stupid, silly things. He's not even questioning it in a silly get up.
And he just did it without question. And I was happy. As soon as he we finished our performance and I asked him to bow, I was sobbing like a baby cause I was so proud of him. Oh yeah, I'm sure. So with that in mind, how did you guys actually end up placing? You guys did really well, right?
Yeah. During prelims, we actually got first place and then we got invited to do the finale, which I Niamhr would have expected to do. We actually got second place and yeah. And I think the biggest compliment was was the First place winner for the finale. She she actually called me a couple of weeks ago.
Cause I asked her a question cause Nemo was actually supposed to lay down in the freestyle, but dingus was getting the bow confused with the lay down. And so we have, a hybrid bow with both of our knees. I guess in he's like downward dog or something like a camel.
Yeah, he's doing that and then he just rubs his face in the dirt and like just literally just goes back and forth with his face like i'm just like no put your butt down and it's like the early 2000s like you know this The song with the butt up in there. I don't know.
That's what he does. It annoys the crap out of me. Cause it's so frustrating. And he's the most challenging horse I've ever had to teach to lay down. And I'm Niamhr teaching lay down and bow in the same time ever again, because this is the problem I created. So she called me and told me like what I can try to do to try to get him to lay down and she's up and she was all like, What you did in the freestyle was something that I'll definitely be taking notes on because that was amazing.
And that really truly touched my heart because three times in a row. So I know that was a big compliment. So what you're saying is I shouldn't try to do freestyle this year. I'm not going next year because I promised my friend that if I did freestyle I would do a, I would do a make, a Mustang makeover.
So I'm trying to do the Fort Worth Mustang. No, if I have to compete against her next year. Yeah no don't do it. Yeah. She'll beat everybody. Yeah. Yeah. She's amazing. Yeah. Your story is so inspiring and I hope it inspires our listeners. And you've shown that there's life after a tough diagnosis, like kissing spine.
What's the biggest lesson that you've learned from this journey with Nemo? I guess my biggest thing was the modas like throughout my whole freestyle is I guess the Finding Nemo, just keep swimming. Yeah. Just keep going forward. And I think that's that's something that just really does, yes.
Translate to just every journey with horses. Is that you look around and every person around you has been through some aspect of what you're going through. And it's nice to know that you have that kind of solidarity in the world. It's a little bit of the reason that we created this podcast is that people can share their stories and know that they're not alone.
And to know that if they just keep going, there's light at the end of the tunnel. Exactly. Yeah. It was very soul crushing to get that diagnosis, but it was very nice to have others around me supporting me and helping me along the way to just keep moving forward. And there's going to be light at the end of the tunnel.
Yeah. What advice would you have for other riders or trainers that might be dealing with a similar diagnosis? Is there anything that you wish you'd known or any advice that you could give? Yeah. The advice I would give is definitely have a vet that knows what your goals and aspirations are with your horse and want to, yeah, see you do those things and [00:42:00] truthfully, be honest with you if it's actually achievable or not.
And yeah. Oh gosh. Definitely start the rehab process as soon as you can. Don't wait because the longer you wait the harder it's going to be. So definitely do a lot of, I think that also like you talking about him going to a rehab facility and doing Aquatred and for the people that might not have experience with that I think the undertone there is not only was he getting rehab for the kissing spine, but he was also creating muscular and cardiovascular fitness by doing the aqua tread.
And so it wasn't like when you got him back, you were starting with a horse that had zero fitness on him. He was physically feeling probably pretty darn good in his body because the aqua tread creates a lot of resistance and, it does build them up in a really nice methodical way. And I think.
Yeah. That's a great point and just, if you're going to do the rehab, adding in those additional measures like that is crucial to being able to continue on that journey in a successful way. Obviously if you had a longer timeline, maybe you wouldn't have had to do the Aquatrad and everything.
You could have just done it yourself. But I think because you were on a truncated timeline, having all those additional resources was so important and so crucial in his recovery. No, yeah, no, I totally agree. I think the biggest aspect for him being able to do what we're doing, I'm practicing to do a hunter pace with my friends, a 11 year old daughter to go with her actually next week with Nemo and he's jumping around.
I don't think any of this would be possible without us doing the aqua tread because it actually. It wasn't forced, but it taught him how to carry himself in the way he's supposed to carry himself without putting more strain on his back. Yeah. So yeah. All so we have a couple of quick fire questions for you to finish off the episode.
Did Emily, did you give these to her in advance? Oh, she totally did. I did, but then I've got paper everywhere. No, you didn't. Oh, you. No, we're not that great. Do the Peppa Pig thing on you, hang up on you super fast. Okay the first question is, what is your favorite OTTB success story besides Nemo?
Christina was supposed to tell me more about this said horse, but she Niamhr did. She just sent me videos actually this earlier today. But it's actually the mare that she took to R. P. This year. That horse actually, I think Jade favor sourced sourced as well. What I remember, I don't know if I'm quoting this correctly or not, but I know she had ankle surgery as well as she came came to Christina Skinnett, like Skinny very skin and bones and she was definitely a big rehab project and it was very nice to see her competing at RP and she actually did very well.
So I definitely look up to those two as well as not just an OTDB, but I also look up to Katrina Atwick with what she's doing with Off the Track Thoroughbreds here in Texas. Thanks. What is a quirky or fun trait about Nemo that will always make you smile? He's very good at injuring himself.
No, I'm kidding. It doesn't make me smile. That makes me roll my eyes. No, what makes me smile is actually, so he would not take treats from me for the first year. So he actually only started taking carrots from me last month. So that was the biggest, I was super happy. He still won't take other things, peppermints are a no go.
I think I ruined that with him. Peppermint flavored but wheNiamhr he wants something, so I taught him how to smile. So he'll actually flip his lip up. And if you want something, whether it be me, scratching his chest or something like that, he'll flip his attention.
Exactly. I'm like, oh, you learned this. Okay, at least this is a bit like a cute bad habit you have. Yeah. It's like when you teach your dog tricks and then you ask them to do something and they do every trick they have. Oh yeah, yep. It's the clicker training.
Yes, exactly. If Nemo could talk, what would his catchphrase be? Hold my beer.
Oh, you have a timeframe for this? Hold my beer. Let me show you let's make it smaller. Oh my God. Love it. And finally, what is one word you would use to describe an OTTB? Definitely perseverance and they've got the endurance to keep on going. They've got big hearts.
Yeah. Awesome. Jules, your story and Nemo's journey are such an inspiration. What's next for you two, and do you have any big goals on the horizon besides your paper chase hunter pace that you're doing? Yeah our biggest goal is to Teach the big fish how to lay down instead of doing a downward dog.
But my goal I'm gonna keep it nice and simple I'm gonna hope that we can do at least novice eventing maybe in a couple years or so I'm gonna take it nice and slow and Whatever he wants to wheNiamhr he tells me he's ready to step it up and stuff and definitely work more on our liberty tricks since and all those things so Nice.
That's awesome. Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing your journey with us today. Where can listeners go to follow you and Nemo's story? Other than the podcast. Yeah, I was gonna say, I would say his Facebook. But I don't really post much on there. , my Facebook, I'm very active on there.
And it's not, I don't post anything but Nemo. If you guys want to see Nemo. You can follow me on Facebook. I'm totally okay with that. I'm very open and , I'm a chatty Kathy. If you message me, I'll definitely answer. So I love it. Thanks again, Jules. And to our listeners, be sure to stay tuned for more incredible OTTB underdog stories in this series.
If you like what you heard today, be Please leave us a five star review on Apple podcasts. [00:48:00] You can follow OTTB on tap on Instagram, Facebook, and Tik TOK, and also sign up for our newsletter and bonus content at www. ottbontap. com. We love hearing from you until next time. Cheers. You were supposed to say it with me.
I know.